ACR viper disapointment...

last_in · Mar 26, 2010

sick 660r · Mar 26, 2010

I cant even finish reading this thread.

clint you're like a woman on her period, all you do is bitch!

WeezyRT · Mar 26, 2010

last_in said:

:funny::mullet:

70Cuda383 · Mar 26, 2010

clint282cc said:
its an exaggeration. but still, they can hang at 9600rpm at 850hp which is 200 more than the v-10 and 2 less cylinders, and probably the same cost... that v-10 is seeing WAY less rpms. look at the dyno. did it reach 6k? and thats on a road coarse. im sure it has an average rpm of 4500 throughout a day of racing. while a nascar would have an average of 7k+

exactly. 9600 RPM. they last what? 500 miles? remember, HP is a function of torque and RPM. ANY engine can make 1000 rpm, you jsut gotta spin it fast enough. nascar motors don't have ANY torque, they're made to be a high RPM engine that hangs at that RPM lap after lap after lap, at WOT, where the RPM only fluctuates a couple hundred during the entire lap.

that Viper motor is ALL TORQUE...he said what...640 hp, and 605 torque? that means it's a torque monster from 1200 rpm through 6,000 rpm, and they built it that way so that the road race car can pull hard out of the corners. I wonder what kind of RPM that V10 would make if they put some light weight springs on the valves, light weight valves, etc. for high RPM stability and spin it to 9600 RPM...that "pussy V-10" would be making 1100 Hp. but it'd have no bottom end, no acceleration, but it would run circles around Nascar on a big oval all day long.

how long does it take a stock car to reach full speed? I think they say it takes an entire lap to get back to speed after a pit stop...that's 2 miles! if it took you 2 miles to run through the gears and hit max power...you'd be worthless on a road course.

you gotta keep in mind what the engine is built for and how they intend to use it. 640 hp from that V10 and it'll probably run the whole season and never have to go into the engine. Nascar throws their stuff away after 1 race weekend, so maybe 1000 miles? 1500 miles?

Top Fuel dragsters are making 8,000 Hp, but their engines only last 1/4 mile

70Cuda383 · Mar 26, 2010

by the way, the equation for Hp is (torque x RPM) / 5252 any dyno graph you look at, the HP and Torque curves always meet at 5252.

Hp is a bragging rights number...Torque is what moves you. think of it this way...torque is how much rotational force your engine makes per revolution...now factor in time...the more revolutions you make at that torque in a given amount of time, the more power you are going to have.

looking at torque:

Nascar: 800 hp at 9600 RPM is about 430 lbs of torque
the V-10 in that video: 640 hp @ 6,000ish RPM--like he said in the video, 605 lbs torque.

yup. I'll take that V10 over the Nascar V8 anyday of the week, because the V10 is going to plant your ass in the seat with 600 lbs of torque, the Nascar engine will feel like driving a honda, waiting for "Vtec" to kick in at 9000 RPM.

and that V10 will make that 600 lbs of torque a lot longer than the Nascar motor will be making 430 lbs of torque.

what's better now?

dkjones96 · Mar 26, 2010

sick 660r said:
I cant even finish reading this thread.

clint you're like a woman, all you do is bitch!

Fixed. haha

shelby/dakota · Mar 26, 2010

BUT. now your proving my point even more... if chrysler produces a FACTORY car with 600hp... and all they can get out of that car is 640... thats a 40hp increase... you dont see a problem with that?

and you talk about dodge as if its some poor ass company. didnt then just get like billions from the government? you do know they spend millions every year on r&d for the hemi and VVT motors right?

I know this was already explained that the Hemi and that makes money for dodge but the V10 doesnt but I wanted to throw out a quick comment anyways.
In the course of a year Dodge sells only a few thousand Vipers like well under 10k a year, so the viper came out in the mid 90s so you do the math if they sell 5000(simple #) a year at a cost to just brake even on the cars lets call it 100k. so that is $500mil in a year again this is at a theoretical just braking even point IDK actual numbers off hand. Now say that the viper came out in 95(again a simple #) take $500mil and multiply by 15 and that is what they have sold the vipers for in 15 years.
Now onto the Hemi. No idea here for numbers but can get my general point out. The Hemi has been Mopar's flagship engine for decades now and hence has received lots of R&D over the years. They can build a Hemi for considerably less then the V10. Now the Hemi comes in what Rams 1500 and 2500, Chargers, Challengers, and various other cars. So they are selling more Hemi cars in a single year obviously then they do Vipers. They would make more money off the Hemi then they do the V10. What would you invest your R&D money into? A niche sports car that sells limited amounts in a year vs. a full production line of cars with a motor that already has lots of R&D into it.
Another fun fact Vipers sell used for close to what they cost new compared to Vettes and other car. This is because they are a limited production car and not many are out on the streets compared to vettes.
That is my post, correct me if wrong or yell and scream, I just wanted to get that bit of info out.

EasyEDak3.9 · Mar 26, 2010

This car is made to go around corners/turns very fast without problems. It's a track car...Not a drag car. What good does 1000hp give you if you have to make turns? Then it would just be too ridiculous to handle...

Mopar4Life · Mar 26, 2010

You think that's a na viper motor to the max? LoL. That's a modest motor. Don't forget those motors are nothing but 5.9 360s with two extra cylinders. It's a pushrod motor, not a lambo motor.

WeezyRT · Mar 26, 2010

Mopar4Life said:
You think that's a na viper motor to the max? LoL. That's a modest motor. Don't forget those motors are nothing but 5.9 360s with two extra cylinders. It's a pushrod motor, not a lambo motor.

Why'd you post the same exact thing one page one and page four like 5 hours apart?

70Cuda383 · Mar 26, 2010

WeezyRT said:
Why'd you post the same exact thing one page one and page four like 5 hours apart?

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt...he posted it and walked away, computer froze, he came back, saw the internet error, and hit re-fresh which would re-send the post a 2nd time.

either that, or he's just a flipping idiot!:jester:

Five9Dak · Mar 26, 2010

Mopar4Life said:
You think that's a na viper motor to the max? LoL. That's a modest motor. Don't forget those motors are nothing but 5.9 360s with two extra cylinders. It's a pushrod motor, not a lambo motor.

Lambo was contracted to do the heads for the viper engine. I don't know if they still do on the third gens though.

Mopar4Life · Mar 26, 2010

70Cuda383 said:
I'll give him the benefit of the doubt...he posted it and walked away, computer froze, he came back, saw the internet error, and hit re-fresh which would re-send the post a 2nd time.

either that, or he's just a flipping idiot!:jester:

You just played God lol, that's exactly what happened.

Mopar4Life · Mar 26, 2010

bad425rt said:
640hp n/a for a car that's designed to go balls out for extended periods of time is pretty impressive, imo. Sure, you can get more power out of it, but they're building it to be reliable for road racing.

Exactly

70Cuda383 · Mar 26, 2010

Mopar4Life said:
You just played God lol, that's exactly what happened.

That's because I am god.

Mopar4Life · Mar 26, 2010

70Cuda383 said:
That's because I am god.

- Morgan Freeman voice

danbap · Mar 26, 2010

viper motors are sick. with a 250 shot they wake up! theres a guy that went from 410hp 460tq at the tire stock to 723rwhp and 879rwtq!!! thats insane!

Sackman · Mar 27, 2010

The ACR is a factory spec race car. the limited horsepower makes sense. think about it, have you ever tried to go into a corner with that much horsepower? the viper is squiggly enough as it is in the corners is it does need anymore. If it had more power the car would be more than a handful. just my .02...

mopar318 · Mar 27, 2010

clint282cc said:
your right it does. 1500hp out of a boosted v-10 is good but they make that power out of inline 6s.

they make 850hp nascar engines that run over 10krpm for a full day... i think 640 is not an excuse for reliability.

if someone on the forums made that power out of a v-10 i would say HEY BADASS DUDE! your making over 550hp to the wheels! sweet! BUT since this is a chrysler guy who has been building these motors for 29 years!!! and all he can squeeze out of a v-10 is 140 more hp over stock? really?

http://www.streetfire.net/video/comp-cams-lsr-camshaft-install-upgrade_740329.htm

im a mopar guy but damnit, why isnt mopar making motors like this that can gain 10% more power JUST FROM A CAM!!

Nascar engines run for a few hours, and they maintain a single power band throughout an entire race.Their engines get rebuilt after every race...I dont see them lasting 24 hours.

Look at the power band on a nascar engine. Nothing till about 7000RPM. Trying slowing down to almost a dead stop around a hair pin and accelerating out of it using your power to pull you out from under steer.

mopar318 · Mar 27, 2010

Mopar4Life said:
You think that's a na viper motor to the max? LoL. That's a modest motor. Don't forget those motors are nothing but 5.9 360s with two extra cylinders. It's a pushrod motor, not a lambo motor.

Haha, are you kidding me?? Um, the viper v10 has an aluminum block and heads. Protoype blocks WERE casting by Lamborghini.

ACR viper disapointment...

last_in

sick 660r

WeezyRT

70Cuda383

70Cuda383

dkjones96

shelby/dakota

EasyEDak3.9

Mopar4Life

WeezyRT

70Cuda383

Five9Dak

Mopar4Life

Mopar4Life

70Cuda383

Mopar4Life

danbap

Sackman

mopar318

mopar318

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