Little worried here

mikset · Jan 14, 2009

Need some opinions here guys. Got 4.10 Motive gears and a dtt for my 05 Dakota 4x4, plus master install kits. Been reading up on how important it is to get a good install on gears so called around here locally for referrals. A local reputable 4x4 shop here in town referred me to a guy they said does all their customers gears so I figured he must be good and took my truck out to him Sunday. Called him up today just to check on how it was going and he said he ran into a problem. He claims my truck has an 03 front axle in it, not an 05...huh? The truck was actually built in 04 so, OK I'll go with him on that one. Then he said the bearing were different from 03 to 05, again....huh? He's saying he has to order the correct front bearing to make it work because he can't get them locally. Then he said the Motive install kit didn't really have the front shims that he needs and he needs to order shims also. I did a fair amount of research before I even decided to put gears in my truck and nowhere did I see an option or difference from 03 to 05. From what I found they are all the same from 2000 to 2005. I didn't really question him because hey, the dude's got my truck and I figured I need to tread a little bit lightly. I did tell him to hang on to the bearings that were wrong in the install kit and if there was going to be an extra charge I would get Motive to reimburse me for the extra bearings. I suppose it is possible the wrong bearings were put in the kit but I don't get the 03-05 claim.

Him: Well they are damaged.
Me: Oh, you installed them?
Him: Yes, they got damaged when I pulled them back off.
Me: That's ok, I can still read the numbers off them. Little hesitation then he said ok.

My thoughts are the guy screwed up installing the front bearings somehow and damaged them and the shims pulling them back off. I understand that stuff happens and we all make mistakes no matter how good we are and I can live with that. I can't live with someone screwing up and trying to make me pay the extra cost.

More importantly, how worried should I be that the guy doesn't know wtf he's doing and he'll screw up setting up my gears? When I initially talked to the guy he seemed very knowledgeable. Knew all about the dtt and highly recommends them, etc. He did say he always uses Yukons and prefers them. I know some of you guys have done your own gears. Thoughts?

70Cuda383 · Jan 14, 2009

Call motive NOW and ask them about bearing changes from year to year. if Motive says they SHOULD be the same, then he's trying to screw you out of $40 in bearings that he fucked up.

by the way, an '03 axle is going to have a 6 lug pattern. an 05 axle is going to have a 5 lug axle. the dude is smoking crack, trying to tell you it's an 03 axle! (I would believe the "hey, we got this pile of parts left over, use them on the next model year" argument, however, I HIGHLY doubt the factory would take the time to swap out the axle shafts from an 03 axle just to use them up--it would be cheaper for them to sell them to dealers/shops as replacement parts)

on the shims...he's right. Motive only sends you like 3 shims, and they SUCK. when I did my motive install, we ended up using shims the guy had leftover in his shop.

at this point, I would roll with what he's telling you...minus the damaged bearings. and if he screws up the install, then he gets to do the work over for free.

by the way, if he used the new bearing while trying to set pinion depth, he was wrong. you're supposed to use the OLD bearing for that because of the risk of damaging the bearing while pulling it off and on to change shims. once you have it set, throw it together with the new bearing, and verify one last time that it's correct. sounds to me like the bearing was fine, and he damaged it trying to set pinion depth

mikset · Jan 14, 2009

70Cuda383 said:
by the way, if he used the new bearing while trying to set pinion depth, he was wrong. you're supposed to use the OLD bearing for that because of the risk of damaging the bearing while pulling it off and on to change shims. once you have it set, throw it together with the new bearing, and verify one last time that it's correct. sounds to me like the bearing was fine, and he damaged it trying to set pinion depth

Damn, you'd think he would know that if he's a gear guy.

He also said he thought about using the old bearing because they were in such good shape, trucks only got 23,000 miles on it. But said he'd rather put new ones in. Could he have gotten the old ones off without damaging them?

Looking ahead, how much if any gear noise should I have with the new gears? I know it mainly depends on how good they are setup but should they be as quiet as oem?

I'll give Motive a call today about the bearings. Thanks for the info.

caulk04 · Jan 14, 2009

The front axle is the same, period. Corporate c205f

70Cuda383 said:
...by the way, an '03 axle is going to have a 6 lug pattern. an 05 axle is going to have a 5 lug axle....

He's talking about the front axle.

mikset · Jan 15, 2009

caulk04 said:
The front axle is the same, period. Corporate c205f

He's talking about the front axle.

Roger that. Called Motive today and the parts guy said there was no bearing change from 03 to 05 on 8.0 Chrysler front axles. Pretty much already knew that. Hope the guy doesn't try to charge me for them.

More than that I hope he gets the friggin gears setup right and that I'm just being a paranoid bastage. I've just heard so many war stories a bout gears being setup wrong.

70Cuda383 · Jan 16, 2009

caulk04 said:
The front axle is the same, period. Corporate c205f

He's talking about the front axle.

And?!

Re-read what I said.

his gear guy tried to tell him that the front axle was from an 03, that the assembly line must have grabbed a left over 03 axle and put it under the truck, and therefor the bearings are different.

and we all know that flat won't work, because the 05s had a 5 lug bolt pattern on the wheels. 97-04 are all 6 lug bolt pattern wheels.

and as I said--I highly doubt the assembly line is going to take a left over 03 axle, pull the shafts out, and slide in 05 shafts for the proper bolt pattern.

his gear guy is trying to fuck him out of bearings.

ADakotaRTGuy · Jan 16, 2009

Should it not be the same assemblys and just different hubs and shafts? I wonder if that would work. If the assembly is the same but just the hubs are different then we might find a solution for swapping wheels to the 5 lug.

mikset · Jan 17, 2009

Picked up the truck. He did charge me for new bearings. Good news is the gears sound great so far, no noise at all on the drive home so looks like he did a good job setting them up, which was my main concern. BSed with the guy for quite a while and he seems to really know his stuff. He's built several custom front and rear ends for 4x4's and done a lot of circle and straight track cars.

I don't think I'll make an issue over the bearings. If the guy is as good as he seems to be, I'd rather keep a good relationship with him for any future stuff. The extra 50.00 not that big a deal IMO.

Little worried here

mikset

70Cuda383

mikset

caulk04

mikset

70Cuda383

ADakotaRTGuy

mikset

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