Infrared heat gun shows about 203° at the temp sensor.
The factory fan shroud is present, but the bottom rubber splash guard is off due to having warped over time, and the top rubber piece that sits between the radiator and the core support has since cracked and gone away.
I can feel the air being pushed back to the rear of the motor, so it seems the fan and clutch are doing their jobs.
It's interesting because for all these years, the truck never had an issue with overheating. It's apparently characteristic for '98 and '99 trucks to run hotter than the follow-on trucks.
I think an electric aux fan would fit the bill perfectly, is there a kit already in existence? Or is this something I'd have to engineer? I'm fine either way.
I will save the radiator build for the transmission swap, which I guess I will begin acquiring parts for.
The rubber parts do help to direct air thru the radiator rather than allow the air to go around it. If you can find replacements or make replacements it will certainly help with efficiency.
Overheating isn't necessarily characteristic for 98-99 models. However as the miles begin to accumulate engines could begin to overheat, this can happen to any engine. Remember, in the case of the 98-99s these are now becoming 20 yr old vehicles.
I know that some of the newer models which came with the 4.7 had a dual fan set-up. One mechanical, and one electric. I haven't checked to see how difficult it would be to retrofit an electric fan from a newer Dakota into a Dakota that never came with one, but I don't think it could be that difficult. There are also several aftermarket electric fans available. Some could be found at your local auto parts store or online, at sites, such as Summit. One other option is to visit your local salvage yard and look for an older Ford Taurus. The fans on those were considered really good and have a two speed motor. They seem to be pretty popular with those looking for an electric fan. The main issue with any electric fan will be how much fabrication will be necessary for it to work, but if you can pull heads, this shouldn't be beyond your skill level.
I see the top seal is discontinued, but I'll run the part number in the google machine to get ahold of something. The bottom splash guard is still available and not that expensive, so I'll get that too.
My '97 Wrangler runs at the 210° all day long, and has for as long as we've owned it, but it's got half the mileage the Durango does now.
I'll do some more research on getting an electrical fan to assist with cooling. I think that's honestly what it needs.
Fabrication is definitely not beyond my skill level, afterall, I made this:
And I had a hand in the designing and creation of this:
Well, I had placed an order with wermopar for the lower deflector (55055325AC) and get an email that the order was cancelled. Called them up and the part is discontinued and apparently no longer in stock at any dealer either.
It looks like I will either have to find a way to repair mine, or fabricate one from aluminum.
I hope at least the top rubber seal is available from the vendor I ordered that from... I'm coming to find that parts for this truck are getting hard to find in contrast to my 80s Mercedes' for which I can still find plenty of parts for.
Still doing research on the best pusher fan assembly and controller to go for; a lot of what I've seen so far is a complete removal of the viscous clutch fan in favor of an electric unit, but I'd rather keep the clutch fan and get a strong electric unit to assist.
So it seems trucks after 2000 used two puller fans, as the radiator was moved closer to the condenser, and the clutch fan was made narrower. There's no cost effective way to convert to the factory setup of the later trucks, as I don't trust parts like radiators and expansion tanks that have been sitting in junk yards for years on end.
I did find this particular fan: [ame]https://www.amazon.com/UPGR8-Universal-Performance-Electric-Radiator/dp/B00TKZVVOU/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=electric%2Bengine%2Bfan&qid=1564504444&s=gateway&sr=8-10&th=1[/ame]
Available in several sizes, so after measurements, I can determine which will work best for me. Setting it up as a pusher on the radiator, if I can get it between the radiator and the condenser, would allow it to pull off the condenser too, dropping condenser temps and lowering AC pressures; I've noticed in the extreme heat, the AC isn't as strong as it could be given the ambient heat and higher pressures have the compressor shutting off more frequently. The system is fully charged and there are no leaks, I guess this just gets back to the fact that my truck just can't keep cool when it's 98°+ out.
All that remains is a controller of some sort to get it to turn on automatically. I could wire it into a switch, but I'd rather not have to worry about flipping a switch off and on if at all possible.
After more reading around and deliberation, I can see the merit of removing the clutch fan all together. It spares the water pump and it reduces drag on the motor, which both sound good to me.
It seems the Flex-a-lite 180 is going to be the way to go, custom brackets won't be hard to make if I have to, so not too worried about that.
I'm still looking at getting a smaller version of the fan I linked above, to act as a pusher for the condenser, since it currently relies on the pulling effort of the clutch fan to cool it down.
Does that make sense? Or is there a better solution? The flex-a-lite is a nice all-in-one unit with the fan and shroud, so that's appealing. I did look into the Taurus fan, and that could always be an option too, higher CFMs than the FAL 180, I believe. Can the FAL controller control the Taurus fan?
The other appealing thing about the FAL 180, is that with Amazon Prime, I can have it tomorrow and have the truck back up and running as early as tomorrow.
Taurus fan for the win. I had oone on my '01 Dakota R/T and NEVER had a problem. Been in 100 deg heat in slow or stopped traffic and NEVER saw it go above 205 deg.
The fan ha 2 speeds and had mine wired for low speed and used a 30 amp circuit breaker as opposed to a fuse and a 180 deg thermostat. Had my controller set to come on @ 195 deg and off @ 185 deg.
Taurus fan for the win. I had oone on my '01 Dakota R/T and NEVER had a problem. Been in 100 deg heat in slow or stopped traffic and NEVER saw it go above 205 deg.
The fan ha 2 speeds and had mine wired for low speed and used a 30 amp circuit breaker as opposed to a fuse and a 180 deg thermostat. Had my controller set to come on @ 195 deg and off @ 185 deg.
Aux fan didn't move enough cfm's so I replaced it and the stock fan with the Taurus fan. Controller was a Delta Current Control (http://www.dccontrol.com/) unit part #2sp . Very simple to install with excellent instructions.
I went the FAL 180 route for now, if it doesn't work out, I've got a project vehicle it will be perfect for.
It's a nice, snug fit and I got it all wired up. So far I've got it kicking on when the coolant temp at the return for the radiator is 175°, as that's when the scan tool shows about 197°.
Definitely stays cooler, and I imagine it will improve once I get the bottom deflector back on and that top seal which has yet to arrive.
The highest the scan tool reported was 204°, but using the infrared gun on the temp sensor showed only 194°, so I'm still thinking the sensor is reading higher than it actually is. Upper hose temp was around ~185° while the lower hose was ~160-165°.
On my little test drive, the fan ran constantly, but I never got up to speeds higher than about 30MPH here in the neighborhood. Temp gauge NEVER touched the 210° mark.
I'm going to wait til I have the upper seal piece that goes between the radiator and the core support and the bottom deflector back in place before I take it for daytime drive in the heat.
All ducting pieces are back in place to direct airflow, there's now a nice electrical fan that should be flowing more air than the stock mechanical fan, tested the radiator cap again for fun and it checks out, and I'm still having issues.
The drive this morning to work with around 85°F ambient temp was fine. TorquePro was reporting 199.4-203.4° consistently.
Leaving work to come home, with temperatures hitting between 97-101°, once it hit 210 on the gauge, it never dropped below. Traffic was so bad I couldn't move out fast enough to see if it would even drop at speed. Heat and fan on Max didn't help much at all in an attempt to keep temps down.
Either the block warped as well (I honestly didn't think to straight edge and flashlight it being a cast iron block) or there really is an issue with the torque converter causing the trans to run warmer, or there's something else entirely wrong. Short of grabbing an inexpensive 14" fan to act as a pusher when the AC is engaged, I'm out of ideas short of tearing it all down yet again.
ETA: Could it be the AC condenser having a clog, and it's building up excess heat that the fan is pulling that heated air in?
Or that may be that there's an air flow clog; I'd take a water hose, pull the electric fan for a bit, and flush the radiator out from the BACK side through the fins (not a coolant flush, an air flow flush!)
I've had a few cars I've seen with a veritable mulch pile of crap in the front of the radiator; naturally, it won't cool well if no air actually GETS to the radiator!
Two things come to mind.
1. For the torque converter to add that much heat, the transmission cooler lines coming from the transmission to the cooler/radiator would have to be a LOT hotter than the coolant temp. Just something to check with the non-contact thermometer.
2. Do you have a thermostat in it? You might want to put a colder one in it. If the thermostat is only opening at 195, then the colder coolant in the radiator is not getting to the engine to do its job. What is the temperature at the thermostat housing?
Or that may be that there's an air flow clog; I'd take a water hose, pull the electric fan for a bit, and flush the radiator out from the BACK side through the fins (not a coolant flush, an air flow flush!)
I've had a few cars I've seen with a veritable mulch pile of crap in the front of the radiator; naturally, it won't cool well if no air actually GETS to the radiator!
I did just that, I hit the condenser from the back side, not much in the way of debris, but I have a pebble driveway that's in need of pressure washing so I wouldn't really see much anyway.
Two things come to mind.
1. For the torque converter to add that much heat, the transmission cooler lines coming from the transmission to the cooler/radiator would have to be a LOT hotter than the coolant temp. Just something to check with the non-contact thermometer.
2. Do you have a thermostat in it? You might want to put a colder one in it. If the thermostat is only opening at 195, then the colder coolant in the radiator is not getting to the engine to do its job. What is the temperature at the thermostat housing?
I'll check the trans line temps later. Letting it cool, had to add just a bit of coolant. I could have sworn all the air was out. I may have to pressure test the cooling system, as something internally might not be doing its job and I'm still looking coolant somewhere. Inspected obvious freeze plugs and I don't see any signs of external leakage.
There's the standard 195° thermostat in it, but I'll check the housing temp later as well and report back.
I'm still thinking of getting that inexpensive fan to act as a pusher just to help out.
Warms up to the same temp. It's far too hot out to drive prolonged with the AC off and the windows down. Stop and go traffic is brutal, and I can't seem to stomach the heat anymore like I used to. I can't say for certain how it will run on an extended journey with no AC running.
That said it ran just fine this morning on the way to work, so perhaps it's just a matter of ambient temps being so high and I've never paid as much attention to what the needle did in these heatwaves in stop-and-go traffic in the past because there had never been an issue prior. I'd simply glance down at speed and the gauge was always before the 210 mark.
A torque converter can pump out heat if it isn't locking up. When a TC isn't locked, it is slipping and slip creates heat like crazy. A switch can be temporarily installed to test the unit.
Other thoughts…. If the engine is running lean, it can run hotter…A/F mixture might be off
I know the heat has been brutal, but the reason I asked if the engine was running hot with the A/C off, is to determine if theres a problem with the A/C, and if it is contributing to the overheating….
When the engine is running hot, is the A/C able to keep the interior cool? Or does the interior start to get warm too?
A torque converter can pump out heat if it isn't locking up. When a TC isn't locked, it is slipping and slip creates heat like crazy. A switch can be temporarily installed to test the unit.
Other thoughts…. If the engine is running lean, it can run hotter…A/F mixture might be off
I know the heat has been brutal, but the reason I asked if the engine was running hot with the A/C off, is to determine if theres a problem with the A/C, and if it is contributing to the overheating….
When the engine is running hot, is the A/C able to keep the interior cool? Or does the interior start to get warm too?
I'll check the AFR, fuel pressure at the rail is normal, but I hadn't looked into the AFR.
Just starting out, the AC doesn't do much until I get in motion, and the fan kicks on. I've not wired up the fan to kick on with the AC just yet, as I was considering just getting a dedicated aux fan to run when the clutch is engaged.
Once the fan is going and I'm under way, it cools, but will begin to warm slightly if not moving.
Now, I haven't done any driving since I washed the condenser, so that may ultimately prove to be a huge improvement. Thinking about going to a longer drive in an hour or so with ambient temps in the low 80s dipping into the high 70s, with no AC to see how it runs in cooler ambient temps with no AC whatsoever.
Definitely feeling tired, so I don't know if I'll be able to make it out or not.
Did not get out on that drive last night, but just started it up and let it warm up in the 99° ambient temp, with the heater on full blast, still reached 205° on the scan tool, and infrared gun showed temps of 195° to as high as 215° at the thermostat housing. Again, this is sitting in the baking sun, engine fan running, condenser cleaned out and able to test the pull of the fan with a sheet of paper, heater and blower motor on MAX, and it's still getting going beyond the 195° everyone else seems to be able to enjoy in locales such as Las Vegas or southern California.
No coolant was needed to top off before I started it up.
Transmission cooling lines both measured in at 178°F with the unit in Park.
There's a leak somewhere, but I'm not entirely sure where. There's telltale residue from coolant drying all along the radiator and surrounding parts through the form of classic white spots. The passenger side of the radiator shows more coolant having leaked down and dried. The only place I can think of where this could be happening is the overflow hose that goes from the radiator neck to the expansion tank. It's not a nice snug seal on this new radiator, so I used a hose clamp to clamp it down. Guess that didn't solve it either.
I grabbed the MityVac and pressurized the system once more from the radiator cap neck, and no discernible leaking and no obvious noise. Pressure was dropping slightly, at about 1PSI every 5 minutes.
Started it up, no smoke from the exhaust, no hesitation or misfiring, but there was a strange rattling noise somewhere in the front. Couldn't pinpoint it, but it's definitely not a chain rattle. It's more like something rolling around behind the water pump pulley itself, as it had that metallic clank/ring going on.
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