[HwyPilot]

After reading up the best I could (probably half this forum so far), I realized there aren't alot of Durango R/T builds going on. For what it's worth I'll try my best to document what I do, and some of the ohno's along the way.

Here's the story on the beginning:

In 2001 I rented a Durango for about 3 weeks and at the end I wanted to pick one up. At the time I already had a car and a truck, so it wasn't happening. After a decade, I finally threw in the towel last Thanksgiving and picked up my 2003 Durango R/T for $5500. I've had other things going on the last 6 months, so I've been planning what where and why instead of buying stuff and turning my wrenches.

All that's going to change soon, and I need some serious info to avoid messes that have happened in my past (whaddya mean there's no parts available for that year?! - or better yet - whaddya mean the ported heads we just installed don't work well with the stock pistons on that year?!).

The finding part took awhile, I'm a picky man. It had to be an 03 model for the rear disc brakes, and black. As much as I despise keeping a black vehicle clean, it just looks the best on the D in my opinion. Then there's the R/T issue - as much as I hate getting 12mpg - I wanted an old school 5.2 or 5.9engine. Since they discontinued the 5.2 long before 03, it left the R/T. So basically out of a world full of DD's - I was left with a single year/ make/ model/ trim/ color combination. How's that for picky? :waiting:

In comes the next issue which some people suffer from: I'm a picky frugal man. Not to be confused with cheap, frugal is buying only what you need to get the job done. No chrome plating, no stainless trim, no flashy lights streaming my name across the windows. It also means finding what the picky me wants, cheap. Add to that I had to find one that hadn't been slid on it's roof, or rear-ended by a Uhaul truck - actually anything but factory bodywork was totally out of the question.

So here we are after months of an exhausting search. Actually, my wife the leprechaun found our R/T online while I was 200 miles away looking at one I didn't end up buying. Some people would be pissed that they went on a 400 mile goose chase, and then their wife calls to tell you she found the vehicle 70 miles away the opposite direction. After 12 years I've learned to just grin and bear it - and I usually thank her at some point.

That said, I need a smoke and a coke and I'll be back in a few.

 

[HwyPilot]

The basics I've come up with have taken about 6 months of reading and research in my spare time. And just like any other build I've done, I'm going to take my sweet old time doing it, and ask way too many questions. It took me almost 10 years to build my 68 Mustang GT/CS, and about 7 years to build my 86 Toyota 4x4 PreRunner, so I'm hoping to have this done in a year or 2 and not drag things out too long. I'm 40 now and I'd like to drive this thing while I'm still young.

The end result of the build is that I'm going to put the SPORT in Sport Utility Vehicle and build a Durango that can tow anything I hitch it to, while being able to hold it's own stoplight to stoplight. I'm ruling out a high speed hauler, because it's an AWD vehicle that I also need to be able to tow with. You can't have AWD, 3.92 gears, a 7700 pound tow rating, and triple digit speed - not that I'd use it anyway. While I'd like to have a lazy highway cruising gear (1600rpm at 70mph), that's not happening until someone comes up with an overdrive transfer case (you hear me out there gear vendors?).

I'm also hoping this basic build-up will help alot of people along the way, because I've learned alot in the last 25 years of turning wrenches and building everything from a Datsun 240Z to a Ford Gran Torino. I don't know everything, and that's why I ask so many questions.

 

[HwyPilot]

What I'm looking for out of my Durango is about 400hp/400tq, a mellow idle and low rpm power that would rip a tree out of the ground. Added to that concern is making sure my transmission will hold it together, and an added plus would be something anyone could drive safely without too many watchoutfor's.

20+ years ago I had a 67 Mustang Coupe that some fool had converted to power drum brakes..... Now there's a reason Ford didn't put a vacuum booster behind their drum brakes, and I was lucky enough to find out quite a few times. Nothing on this earth like pushing lightly on a brake pedal to have all 4 wheels stop solid while the car is still going 40mph. No matter how many times I'd tell someone before they took my car on a beer run, they'd always have a story for me when they got back - and a location of at least 10 feet of my tires somewhere. Ever since then I've built things someone else could drive if I wasn't able..... for some reason or other (no DWI's so far).

Sorry, back to the build again. I also want to keep the truck as sleeper as possible, other than maybe a ram air hood and intake system at some point (just because they work). For anyone who thinks they have a "CAI" with an air filter underneath the hood somewhere, all I can do is shake my head in disbelief. Where's that "cold air" coming from anyway? You can barely put your hands under the hood after a good run, I guess it needs more cold air. And we've all seen the fool running around town with the hood taken off - but we're not doing anything like that here. Does ram air really work? Yes. And at some point I'd like to try and document that on a dyno pull.

 

[HwyPilot]

So the Durango is sitting alright for now, it's running and it sounds good. Seems like a good reason to tear things apart and change it a bunch, right? When things go well, every upgrade is an improvement. And when things don't go so well, it's ummm time to drink a beer and figure out why I didn't ask more questions. I'm not sure what they call a failed upgrade, but I like to call it unfinished and keep tearing things apart until I forget what I started on and failed.

Case and point: the Supra seat install in my Toyota Pre-Runner. I bought the seats for $300 in great shape and the matching grey, brought em home and went to town. By the time I was done I figured out the earlier Supra seats were the ones that fit (pre-86) and the 87's I bought needed a little massaging. After cutting a 5 inch hole in the floor and beating the ribs flat, all I had to do was weld up some supports and pull my hair out. That was supposed to be a clean install, and I ended up with a junked floor pan. But damn those seats were comfy, and the OEM units belonged in a VW bug.

Then there was the bobbed bed I installed, cutting a foot off the rear of each frame rail. When I went to install longer rear leaf springs and re-hang everything with an axle flip, I ran out of length on the frame.......

Let's face it, there's a hundred wrong answers out there, and that's what forums are for. We'll all see how many right answers there are, because someone somewhere figured it all out somehow. From what I've read so far, there's some members here that know ALOT, and a few that really think they do. Thanks for all of both, it wouldn't be the same without you.

 

[HwyPilot]

Now here's the Durango. Overall, she's in great shape for 125k miles. No rust showing on the exterior, and a small amount starting on the seams in a few areas underneath. This was a PA vehicle for a few years and they washed it pretty well, but somewhere along the way I've got to get some rustproofing and undercoating done while it's still workable. The tailgate is dingy from exhaust and car washes and will probably need to be repainted at some point. Miscellaneous scratches all over the bumpers from who knows what, the hitch receiver is bent on one side (?!), a ding in a door, a few dimples in the hood, and a busted rear fender flare. On the inside I'm missing a piece of window trim on a rear door, it needs new carpet and floor mats, and the drivers seat is lopsided (probably collapsed = broken) and the rear lift motor isn't working.

What I've done so far:

Replace all 4 door speakers with Infinity component separates, I'll be glad to offer up the P/N if anyone needs it. Matching the aftermarket speakers to the infinity on the stock grilles was a nice touch, the main thing was they fit, they were ummm frugal ($105/pair) and they sound AWESOME. They've got silver 6.5" drivers that show through the door grilles - that was a plus I didn't expect. The tweeters were a tight fit in the stock location, and I couldn't use the crossovers with the factory stereo. I added an extremely cheap ($30) MP3 player with a cassette adapter, and for now it has a workable radio/ CD/ MP3 system.

I've done all the basic servicing - changed the fluids - checked everything over. The next step with fluids is switching it over to AMSOIL products as soon as I get things taken care of in an area. Nothings done yet, so I'm using regular oil, etc.

There's a small leak at a valve cover which stinks of burnt oil after I've run it awhile and come to a stop. Simple fix, I'll be switching the V/C gaskets out when I do a tune-up here in the next month or so - no rush, remember? Lazy. I'll probably go with OEM gaskets for now, it doesn't much matter because at some point these heads are getting donated to a land fill.

The first part of this story is just getting it totally drivable (to anywhere without worries), and able to run on an AWD dyno somewhere for a baseline. As good as it runs right now, I'm thinking it could give a good pull and others could work with the numbers on their own if theirs was running right. It won't be a completely stock baseline unless I drag along an OEM air filter element, it has a K&N drop-in, and anything else I do for now will change things also. I've been thinking about using stock replacement parts for the tune-up - not too much of a waste for research, right? I'd like to see how much some of these parts actually matter on this vehicle/ engine combo.

I also found that Meguiar's Ultimate Compound is really easy to use and does a fantastic job, and that Turtle wax polishing compound can scratch the crap out of your paint and leave a mess to clean up. While I was polishing a few months ago I was able to clean my factory alloys up completely (not a single chip anywhere after 8 years and 125k miles!) with Mothers Chrome Polish. For the mirrors and black plastic, Mothers Back to Black is awesome and restored them to new. It's been parked outside for about 2 months since and they've held that new looking finish - I highly recommend that stuff.

It needed tires for the winter, so I had TireRack ship me a set of Yoko A/T's in the stock size for about $138/ea. There were only 2 choices in the size and one of them sucked, so it didn't take much thought, and these things are like studded tires in the snow and ice (AWD and 5k pounds of truck is making them look good). The stock 17's will be my winter wheels, and I'll be looking for some 20's once I get the suspension rebuilt (maybe dropped) and dialed in.

I'll offer up the used rubber soon as I'm sure someone on the forum can use them. They're decent Sport Truck tires, and about half worn, with an outside shoulder band of wear on the passenger side tires. I'll have to get to that, because even after an alignment it still favors pulling to the right slightly... It's done that since the test drive, but I'd planned on rebuilding the front end no matter what I brought home.

I don't have pics to post yet, so this all looks lame and boring - but I'll be posting all kinds of pics soon. I've taken alot and just not swapped them to a PC yet. I might even post some stuff that's totally off topic, since that fits this thread really well :blahblah:

Thanks for an awesome forum (and your patience) - peace out.

 

[PDR1878]

You must be bored.

R/T is a package.. you could have got an SLT+ and just bought the odds an ends...

Anywho, good plans. Hope to see it through. I too am picky..I only gave up the 5.9 for a 4.7 in a metalic gray SLT+ 01 rango. Other than that, fully loaded, clean and what I wanted down to the color.

 

[clint282cc]

idk what hes talking about^^^ sounds like your smart enough to know what an r/t with a 5.9 is...

i cant believe i read all that, but i did. at first glance, i said NO WAY.

you have a lot already figured out. and besides money, this can easily be done in a year. look up "my build thread... finally". its my build thread haha. started about a year ago. and i think A LOT of what i did, you will want to do.

for your hp goals, plan on spending a pretty penny. 408 bottom end, with ported edlebrock heads and mopar M1 intake. probably a 58mm throttle body to. spintech offers the best headers for dakota-durango. but are expensive... i spent the extra cash. but you can also get away with a few other styles. you will want mid-length headers at least. the cam is whats REALLY going to make this motor come alive, and doing what you want to do with it, a realistic number will be 350AWHP. im going to be around 400RWHP and you do not want the cam i have, trust me haha. UNLESS you get some boost...

dynoing your rango... if you take the front driveshaft out, and put it in 4hi, you can dyno on a two wheel drive dyno... wont give you AWD hp.... but probably a lot easier. either way, even on a awd dyno, you will need to put it in 4hi.

brakes, 03 had really good breaks. and you could probably get away with just upgrading pads and rotors. BUT a guy was just selling a NEW IN BOX bracket kit to mount genII viper brakes up front. again, i did this on my dakoa, but i had 99 single piston brakes... not 03 brakes. but still, 14" viper brakes are a lot better tan oem 03 brakes haha. this will also help towing!

i dont see why you cant have a triple digit tow rig? i tow ALL THE TIME with my stock rango and it can tow a small car at 90 no problem. it also has 3.92 gears but with the 46re behind it, the ratio is very close "maybe higher" than my blue truck with 44re and 3.55 gears. i dont remember off hand what my durango cruises at, but my black truck with 4.56 gears cruises 75 at 3000rpm... TERRIBLE. im swaping that out.

the durango r/ts came with 8.25 rear ends instead of the standard 9.25 to save weight... with the awd setup, the 8.25 rear is strong enough, but depending on how much you want to tow, you MIGHT want to upgrade...

i dont know much about the trans... but plan on about $3000 for a badass trans for what you want to do.

here are a few threads you might be interested in...

http://www.dakota-durango.com/forum/showthread.php?t=133159

http://www.dakota-durango.com/forum/showthread.php?t=75420&highlight=SCDE

my build.
http://www.dakota-durango.com/forum/showthread.php?t=119691

its pretty sweet your starting this build and unlike a lot of other talkers, i think your going to build a sweet ass truck. any questions let me know, ill try to help the best i can.

 

[clint282cc]

oh suspesnion... leave it stock height if you plan on towing. the front is already almost on the bump stops and the rear will bottom out real quick unless you get some helper bags and C-notch the frame. remember r/ts are already an inch lower than other durangos.

hotchkins is your friend. they made an AWESOME kit for dakota, and also made stuff for durangos. their swaybar kit will REALLY help you out with towing and handling. again, a few months ago a guy had a set for sale for like $300... i was kicking myself in the ass cause i couldnt afford them... but check into it. if you spend enough time and go back far enough, you will find some sweet deals in the "for sale" section. a guy had a power seat track for sale... pretty cheap if i remember. i was going to buy it, but ended up not needing.

 

[HwyPilot]

You must be bored.

R/T is a package.. you could have got an SLT+ and just bought the odds an ends...

Anywho, good plans. Hope to see it through. I too am picky..I only gave up the 5.9 for a 4.7 in a metalic gray SLT+ 01 rango. Other than that, fully loaded, clean and what I wanted down to the color.

I thought about that, and liked the SLT+ 5.9 well enough - but I couldn't find one. However, I really thought the 16" wheels were weak sauce on something this big. Even the 275/60/17 were floppy for my taste, so they'll be my winter wheels.

 

[PDR1878]

I thought about that, and liked the SLT+ 5.9 well enough - but I couldn't find one. However, I really thought the 16" wheels were weak sauce on something this big. Even the 275/60/17 were floppy for my taste, so they'll be my winter wheels.

I too wanted an R/T trim.. but I knew I'd have better luck finding an SLT+ in such a short amount of time. I wanted to spend 5k cashs rather than $35k and payments for 3 years..

I'm working on converting mine to an R/T trim with the AWD/Transfer case, seats, wheels, and possibly suspension..though I'll probably just beef up the current suspension as I plan on moving back to an area with snowfall.. The 16's do look pathetic on the truck lol I need at least 18's to fill it in

If you switch out/upgrade items on your truck at all that's R/T trimmed let me know.

 

[HwyPilot]

oh suspesnion... leave it stock height if you plan on towing. the front is already almost on the bump stops and the rear will bottom out real quick unless you get some helper bags and C-notch the frame. remember r/ts are already an inch lower than other durangos.

hotchkins is your friend. they made an AWESOME kit for dakota, and also made stuff for durangos. their swaybar kit will REALLY help you out with towing and handling. again, a few months ago a guy had a set for sale for like $300... i was kicking myself in the ass cause i couldnt afford them... but check into it. if you spend enough time and go back far enough, you will find some sweet deals in the "for sale" section. a guy had a power seat track for sale... pretty cheap if i remember. i was going to buy it, but ended up not needing.

I'll check out your build thread, thanks for the info! I'd looked at the 408 specs and I was impressed with the low end power - so that may be an option. It would help to have some extra push down low, and cubes is the only real fix for that. It's a spendy engine, but at 12mpg now I won't lose anything other than upfront cost.

I've emailed Hughes and Southeast for some thoughts - we'll see if I get a reply from them. I'd rather work with a package, as opposed to going the trial and error route with cam profiles, valve sizing, intake, exhaust, etc.

You gotta love timing on parts deals, I've run across alot when I couldn't swing it. And then there's the stuff you could've picked up and didn't...... those are even worse :jester:

In 2001 a friend offered me a totally straight 70 Plymouth GTX (in bumble bee yellow with black stripes and the air grabber hood) for $25,000. He'd just spent a few months building a custom 440 for it and installing a 6 pack (4 barrel car). The customer couldn't pay the bill, and was thinking about just selling it off. It also had a gear vendors over/underdrive to back up the automatic. My wife and I went and looked at the car, and she was completely blown away. In respect for my license and my health I passed up the deal - but it crosses my mind a few times a month.....

 

[clint282cc]

you can put together a motor cheaper and as long as you have a good machine shop, it will be assembles just as good. as far as cam profile, a simple call to comp cams is all thats needed but with all the experience with cams from different users on this site, you will have more than enough info. if yo uwant to call hughes and southeast for opinions, thats fine, but in the long run it will be cheaper to build your own.

 

[HwyPilot]

I too wanted an R/T trim.. but I knew I'd have better luck finding an SLT+ in such a short amount of time. I wanted to spend 5k cashs rather than $35k and payments for 3 years..

I'm working on converting mine to an R/T trim with the AWD/Transfer case, seats, wheels, and possibly suspension..though I'll probably just beef up the current suspension as I plan on moving back to an area with snowfall.. The 16's do look pathetic on the truck lol I need at least 18's to fill it in

If you switch out/upgrade items on your truck at all that's R/T trimmed let me know.

I'll be glad to let you know on anything I run across out here, and any parts I shed in this build. When I was looking over wheels and tires before I bought the R/T (thinking SLT+ and then fixing the 16's), I noticed that 18's come in a weird size/profile for the D's and are costly. 20's are a 45 profile, but with the kind of width these run it still amounts to about 3 inches of sidewall (roughly) at a cheaper price with more options for brand and type. The last time I ran dubs was on my BMX bikes LOL so I'm still skeptical to go that big, we'll see how things go on that one.

Overall the R/T is a great option package and color combo - even came with a blacked out sport grille. Once I get into options for the suspension, etc. I'll know alot more about what I'm going to shed. The only thing I'd change in the R/T package is the suede door trim - that was a poor choice IMO - it gets soaked in the rain, wears like crazy and is nearly impossible to clean. I'll be having some pads made up to replace those at some point.

I'm looking for a source that rebuilds these AWD t/cases to price that up. There's nothing wrong with this one yet (other than being slow to unlock) but time will tell and I want to be prepared. I've been ripped by too many shops in my life (like a certain early 64 Ford 260/289 stroker motor that mysteriously "vanished" from a well known shop in SoCal years ago. They told me the crank was already .022 under, and when I went down to pick up the parts I got a basket full of 68+ small block back (different timing cover was the tell-tale). It wouldn't even bolt to my bell housing! The shop owner just blew me off, and when I ran into him at a dyno a few years later it was all I could do not to thrash him within an inch of his life. I let him be - worse'll come to him at some point - karma's a b1tch.

However that still didn't replace my running, 8500rpm 289 that ran mid 10's with dual quads on a tunnel ram. I wound up finding a later model top loader 4-speed and bell housing to fit a later model engine, and then a friend gave me (GAVE) a 68-70 302 he'd just built as a favor. She turned out nice, no thanks to the shop that screwed me.

 

[HwyPilot]

you can put together a motor cheaper and as long as you have a good machine shop, it will be assembles just as good. as far as cam profile, a simple call to comp cams is all thats needed but with all the experience with cams from different users on this site, you will have more than enough info. if yo uwant to call hughes and southeast for opinions, thats fine, but in the long run it will be cheaper to build your own.

True that, as long as they know what they're doing and back it up. Unlike the shop that left an oil galley plug out on a certain Toyota 22re that went into my pre-runner. 5psi of oil pressure at start-up, failed burn-in and had to tear it down again to find it. Then the engine threw a rod about 3 hours run time, and I had to fight with them to replace the engine. New engine ran like crap, come to find out they'd swapped me with a 22r (non-EFI) with much lower compression (my 22re had already been shaved along with the timing cover). If I could've dropped my truck through the roof of that shop - I might've done it! I wound up spending another $1400 on a better top end after that (from someone else, I never went there again), but my truck was down for months. It seemed "faster" to have the shop rebuild it so I could drop it back in - live and learn.

That was nothing in the loss section, that truck was stolen from a security storage yard a couple years ago - uninsured........

 

[clint282cc]

I'm only 22 and I have stories like you. I hope I have as many experiences as you did when I'm 40 lol. Most people build one or two rides in their life... and those are usually easy and common. I like your style.

 

[Misfit]

I'm only 22 and I have stories like you.

He ain't lyin..:mullet:

 

[Misfit]

This is one hell of a thread, you got everything in there except your blood type and social security number lol But i like these long build threads rather than " hey i got this and that and im gonna do this and that, and i will post pics when its done"

I love these build threads, like Clint's and Kingstr's, lots of pics, very informative.

 

[clint282cc]

i cannot believe i still cant rep you misfit... so im repping you here!

+REP

 

[Misfit]

I just tried to rep you and it gave me the same message lol

 

[HwyPilot]

Clint and Misfit - you 2 seem like some good people to know, and thanks for your input so far. I just got a note back from John @ Southeast with a pile of great pics on one he's working on right now - wow! I can tell it'll be great doing business with him, and to top it off he gave me some details on his own Durango. It helps a ton when someone drives what they build, always makes me wonder about the rest!

Stories, yeah at least I came away with something for all the trouble LOL. I started out building my own vehicles when I was a broke joker 25 years ago, and never changed. A short list would look something like this:

1978 Datsun F10 (heheh high school hand me down car)
1967 Ford Mustang coupe - first car I bought - 289 2bbl, auto, rare white interior
1973 Ford Gran Torino Sport - 53k orig mi - 400M 2bbl, auto - swapped to 4bbl on ported 2bbl heads (hot setup as 4bbl heads were crap) - Art Carr C6 trans, lowered, etc
1990 Honda Civic DX hatch - bought new to build that body - lowered, Jackson Racing, etc - the OG dropped Honda
1983 Ford Mustang GLX convertible, 3.8L V6, auto, bone stock
1988 Nissan Maxima SE - lowered on Tokico hardware - cruiser
1989 Nissan 200SX SE V6 - didn't own it very long - handled badly because of the V6
1968.5 Ford Mustang GT/CS - 302, 4 speed, take a page to list all by itself 170+ mph
1976 Dodge 1 ton Club Cab cab/chassis with utility bed - 440 V8, 4 spd - work truck
1990 Ford F150 - bought new - huge mistake - problems, problems, problems- lemon
1972 Datsun 240Z - owned it just long enough to clean it up and sell it - way too small
1984 Honda Accord DX 5 speed - bought for a girlfriend to drive - doubled my money selling it
1994 Toyota T100 sr5 4x4 - bought new - solid truck with flaws - expensive
1993 Acura Integra SE - Kaminari catalog car - lowered, body kit, etc
1986 BMW 325es - 5spd, 2.5L I6, loaded, bone stock wife's car
1986 Toyota sr5 4x4 xtraCab 5 spd, 22re, buckets, console, wht/gry - built to PreRunner - heavily modified - stolen
1987 Toyota Supra - 5 spd, TRD lowered, exhaust, system, etc - wrecked it LOL
1991 BMW 535i - auto, 3.5L, cam, Eibach and Bilstein, 17's, system, Dinan 241hp ECU, tuned by Callas Rennsport, slotted rotors w/ EBC pads
1995 Dodge Neon sedan - auto, SOHC - daily driver (loved that car) - Eclipse system - unbreakable
2000 VW Beetle Turbo - 5spd, 1.8L 16V, stock and FAST - wife's car - sold due to gremlins
1984 GMC G30 1 ton cab/chassis - 14' box, 3 spd auto, 350 V8, work truck
1991 Chevy G30 1 ton passenger van - 350 EFI, 4 spd auto, work truck
2003 Honda CR-V EX - 4spd auto, best car Honda's ever built, wife's ride
2005 Honda CR-V SE - 5spd auto, leather, even better best car, wife's current ride
2005 Volvo VNL64T780 (yep that's a big truck) - Cummins 550HP (1650tq) ISX, 13 spd, etc
2003 Dodge Durango R/T - bone stock, so far

PHEW - and there's 4 or 5 bikes I didn't bother to list - but it's a list. I remember most of the setup on those, so if anyone has any questions feel free to ask.